It seems Germany is family-focussed to an extreme degree. All these tickets that you can buy that let 5 people travel for next to nix. Meanwhile solo travellers have to pay full whack.
This is pissing me off. I can see that without some sort of discount families would find it hard to take trips. But when push comes to shove single people get a double whammy. We pay tax to subsidise services we don%26#39;t use - all our working lives - education for the sprogs; health servives for the mothers and the sprogs. Swimming pools for the little darlings
My taxes pay for your children. But when I want to travel I am clobbered by single supplements (I refuse to travel with any organisation that applies them) and I am excluded from any of the cheap fares because I chose to travel alone.
Is this fair?
I think it%26#39;s time for single people to refuse to pay for the upkeep of the sprogs unless we get something back in return.
Don%26#39;t you?
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I%26#39;ll make a few comments. First, the ticket offers such as the Laender tickets usually are available to single people, what may cost 27 euros for 2-5 people traveling together, may cost only 18 euros for the same single ticket. Obviously you don%26#39;t get the same per person savings as 2 or more people, but you still get substantial savings over your other alternatives.
Second, it is possible to book a single room in Germany for less than a double room saving you money. However, it still usually won%26#39;t be as cheap as the per person cost of sharing a room.
I also don%26#39;t like much of the way local transportation is priced. As a single rider, a day ticket usually makes no sense for what I do. However, with a group ticket you don%26#39;t have to do much riding and you almost immediately will be saving money. But that%26#39;s the way it is. I doubt that public transportation would be better off if families drove or didn%26#39;t go instead of using it, then they would have even less money to pay for the services offered and transportation costs would rise for you whether by taxes or by higher user fees.
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%26gt;I think it%26#39;s time for single people to refuse to pay for the upkeep of the sprogs unless we get something back in return.
Most single people get %26quot;sprogs%26quot; in the end as well. I think your comments are arrogant and short-sighted.
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%26gt; It seems Germany is family-focussed to an extreme degree. All these tickets that you can buy that let 5 people travel for next to nix.
You don%26#39;t have to be a family to use these tickets. There are of course family tickets but also normal group tickets that can be used by a group of friends, colleagues, strangers, ...
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In general terms I agree, although I find the UK far more biased against single people than Germany. At least when I book a room in Germany, I can get a single price, the online bookers don%26#39;t automatically put %26#39;2%26#39; in the %26#39;guests%26#39; box and so on.
However, I%26#39;m quite happy with the Laender single prices - although I appreciate that more people would save more but hey.
I%26#39;m single, too old for children, and frequently travel solo ~ but not a sad, childless, friendless spinster either! And in Germany I can go into a cafe or restaurant without it looking like I%26#39;ve been stood up!
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altimoro:
%26quot;Most single people get %26quot;sprogs%26quot; in the end as well. I think your comments are arrogant and short-sighted.%26quot;
Really? What on earth do you mean? Why arrogant? why shortsighted? You can%26#39;t just toss out that sort of crap without backing it up.
You must understand that I am not knocking Germany - this is the way it works in all developed countries. And I think it%26#39;s about time it stopped. If you want kids, then you should pay for them. I%26#39;d rather see my taxes going to the third world. And I predict that forward looking counties may offer that as an option to tax payers before too long.
Ailidh - you are right - that%26#39;s a positive. But then it would be true all over SE Asia so why shouldn%26#39;t it be the case in developed Europe?
Would you care to comment on your comparative experiences elsewhere?
Thx all.
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%26gt;If you want kids, then you should pay for them. I%26#39;d rather see my taxes going to the third world.
Are you really that naive? I��m saying this without having kids - or planning to have any for the enxt time. But have you ever considered how d..ed expensive it is to have childrens as it is now? People who have children pay and pay and pay if they want to make their children��s life worth living. I am glad they get a break.
If you knock away ANY support for families, you make sure that the population will die out in short order - and the only ones who have children are ones that are too stupid to use contraceptives.
May your taxes be wasted in some third world cleptocracies. I am sure supporting a petty tyrant��s weapon project is much more rewarding that supporting your enighbour��s family.
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%26gt;And I predict that forward looking counties may offer that as an option to tax payers before too long.
I am really curious what you mean by this. Additional tax on children?
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%26gt;Why arrogant? Why shortsighted?
Arrogant because you think that your chosen lifestyle is the only one that matters.
Shortsighted because you cannot imagine that your plans for life might change (unless you are biologically %26quot;programmed%26quot; into a situation that excludes having a family)
I stand by my comments.
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altamiro - what makes you assume that all those who use this forum are of child-bearing age? What makes you assume that all people have the choice to have a child or not?
As I said right at the beginning, I can see that some sort of discount is desirable for families because, yes, rearing children is expensive. And I agree that direct taxation should offer allowances.
I just think it is slanted too far in favour of families. Travel is a prime example and the group tix policy of German Railways is like adding insult to injury and led to my mini-rant!
So a group of %26quot;friends%26quot; can travel together for next to nix. They could be middle aged people with good jobs belonging to a club or something, or a group of football supporters. If there are five of them they get to travel for c.6 euros each and I pay 18. The gap is too large. I guess that%26#39;s what I%26#39;m saying.
On the positive side, it does keep cars of the road.
Rant over, and looking forward to my first visit to Germany as a destination rather than somewhere to go through to get somewhere else.
Cheers.
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Maybe you%26#39;ll enjoy what I do:
efficient travel systems that all integrate with each other%26#39;s timetables, are clean and run on time
polite service providers in shops, restaurants, hotels
children in public well behaved
and that%26#39;s in addition to stunning scenery, stupendous architecture and friendly people!
I like the food too.
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